Exercise 10: 10 Valuable People

by Hayden Kessinger
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    • #19886
      Hayden Kessinger
      Participant

      Apologies if I’m overstepping by creating this! Please edit or delete if needed.

    • #19887
      Hayden Kessinger
      Participant

      Exercise 10

      My Substack post

      Hi everyone. The Initiative class is over… kinda. This past week was officially our last week but I didn’t complete the final exercise. Given what I wrote about in my last post, I’m quite happy about this as well. I was able to get a lot done this week while also taking care of other important aspects of my life like my real job, socializing, exercising, relaxing, and sleeping. I didn’t push myself to have conversation after conversation because I wanted to prioritize rebalancing my life. It’s easy for me to say, “well, I can just grind it out this week and then get back on track next week.” But then I can say that same thing again, or some other version of it to rationalize another less-than-ideal situation. I do think there are times when doing that is necessary and helpful, but now is not one of those times.

      This week I had 7 conversations with people I view as valuable in the field. The first was with Johannes, co-creator of Effective Animal Advocacy Austria (EAAA). This is a group that functions very similarly to the project idea that I came up with. I spoke with Johannes a few weeks back and he helped me see what I really wanted to create. He inspired me to shift my focus from improving communication skills to discussing effective animal advocacy and connecting members with more meaningful opportunities to help animals. After my chat with him on Monday, I decided how I want to move forward.

      Together with his friend Kevin (who I also chatted with today), Johannes has spread EAAA to eight different countries around the world. The groups utilize the same resources and tailor them to their specific needs. So, I’m going to heed the advice I received from several others and not re-invent the wheel. Since I’m moving in two months, I won’t be fully establishing an “Effective Animal Advocacy Albany”, but I’ll be introducing it! I’ve checked with my boss and got the green light to have a meeting at the Five Rivers visitor center some time in October. The only sticking point is that I have to be clear that I am not representing DEC as it is such a large bureaucracy with specific guidelines and, as state employees, we can’t be involved in lobbying or anything like that. In the meeting, we’ll have time for socializing and snacking before we discuss a topic I have yet to decide. I initially thought I would give a succinct presentation of the core ideas of effective animal advocacy, then people could ask questions and we could discuss as a group. However, Kevin advised me to have a slightly more focused and open discussion so people don’t feel lectured at. Instead, they’ll feel invited and encouraged to share their thoughts, making for a more enjoyable experience and learning process. So, I have some thinking to do. Either way, I’m excited to put this plan in motion!!

      From my call with Johannes I also realized that I could take this anywhere. I didn’t know it had spread to so many places already. Seeing their success inspired me to believe I could be a part of it too. I even considered the possibility of going all in, seeking funding for the project and making it my full-time focus. I could move to DC where I already have some connection to the Effective Altruism community and really make it happen. I’m not by any means committing to this now, but it feels good to consider it as plausible. Before, I was stuck feeling like my project was bound to fizzle. It’d be a good idea and maybe gain some traction, but it wouldn’t hold up. That can absolutely still happen, but I can at least see the possibility of success now. I can feel the excitement of actually creating something and helping people help animals.

      Several of the other calls were not directly related to this project but they were all with people in the same field. I was gaining insights and advice on getting into a career and more volunteering roles in animal advocacy. In fact, one conversation was with Marine Lercier, founder of a brand new organization based in France called the International Center for Animal Rights and Ethics (ICARE). I applied for a volunteer fundraiser role and after our meeting on Thursday, it seems I got it!! This is an amazing opportunity to learn and grow a lot and potentially significantly help this new organization. Entry level roles in animal advocacy are hard to come by, and especially in fundraising because grant-writing and securing funds is so crucial to nonprofits they need people who really know what they’re doing. Marine doesn’t mind my minimal experience and said that I can learn as I go. There are online grant-writing and fundraising courses that I can take and more people I can connect with to learn from!

      Right now I have one conversation scheduled for next week and a few more in the following week. I’ll be reaching out to more people over the weekend to try and set more up. I feel pretty good about the project and now just need to decide on my topic and start inviting people!

      Reflections

      I’ll be referencing the seven principles from Initiative, so here they are:
      1. Personality matters less than skills you can learn
      2. The idea of a lifetime comes once a month
      3. Better than a great idea is an okay idea plus market feedback, flexibility, and iterations
      4. Start where you are with what you have
      5. Pitch and they’ll judge, ask advice and they’ll help
      6. The problem leads to the solution
      7. Almost nothing inspires like helping others so much that they reward you for it

      This week felt like the perfect balance for me. I had a good number of meaningful conversations while also maintaining other important aspects of my life. I didn’t put too much pressure on myself to complete the exercise perfectly. I’m happy with how it went but have some things to improve. First, I drifted away from the script a little too much, I think. The conversations were still very helpful, but I forgot to ask for referrals or specific advice from most people. I think I got a little bit complacent, feeling like my project was where I wanted it to be, so I didn’t need more advice. That’s obviously not the case! I also wish I was more intentional with my meetings; I could have been more prepared with questions I wanted help answering or things that each specific person could help me with the most.

      I think I’m getting better everyday at asking for help and advice instead of pitching ideas or solutions. I’ve been applying principle #5 in all parts of my life. It simply feels better to approach someone with humility and ask for their help than to come to them with an idea without inviting them to respond. When doing the latter, it’s often met with judgement and a kneejerk response to list all the problems instead of excitement to try to make it work. This can lead me to feel crummy about my idea and ultimately scrap it altogether. Similarly, principle #3 is proving to be as accurate as anything. Comparing what my project was at the start to what it is now is pretty impressive. I suppose it didn’t undergo an unbelievable transformation, but it has definitely improved and become more valuable to me thanks to advice and iterations.

      Many of the other principles have been very applicable, especially as of late. My meeting with Marine about joining as a fundraising volunteer is a perfect example of the coming together of principles #1, #4, and #7. I’ll be jumping into a role with very little experience but it seems clear that I can learn the necessary skills. And Marine’s interest in bringing me on board felt really good, like I can really help her.

      I’m thinking more about principle #6 because I have a new sub-problem that I need to solve. As I mentioned earlier, I’m not sure how exactly to run the meeting or what to focus on. It’s an introductory meeting, but I also don’t want people to feel the typical negative emotions (frustration, boredom, helplessness, resentment, etc.) associated with being lectured at or told what to do. So, my focus now will be figuring out the most effective way to structure the meeting to keep people engaged and interested in the concept.

      Now at the end of the exercises, I feel pretty great about talking to people about things that are important to me. I still experience feelings of anxiety and think things like “who am I to take this person’s time” or “they don’t care” but it’s gotten way easier to push past that and just message them anyway. I reach out to several new people almost every day just to connect and see if they want to chat. It seems like everyone I speak with appreciates the conversation, especially when they have the opportunity to share things and help me. I’m learning to talk less and keep my points brief (although this is not easy for me!). I’ve definitely noticed improvements in my relationships at work because of this class. Not that I had any bad relationships but now I feel a lot closer to my colleagues because I’m asking for help more than doing stuff on my own. I’m much more open to advice and enjoy learning from others instead of shutting down when they give feedback. I know that I don’t necessarily have to take their advice (though I often do!), which takes the pressure off.

      I’ll have an opportunity to share my ideas and plans tonight at a vegan potluck I helped organize. It’ll almost be like a test run for the test run.

    • #19892
      Olivia Ong
      Participant

      Update:

      This week I didn’t talk to anyone. Life has been wild.

      Reflection:
      We’ve been talking a lot about how initiative helps people to figure out what matters the most to them. This week, I was juggling a series of urgent and important client meetings and also tried to finish a few things with my job. I ended up reaching out to nobody and talking to nobody about my project. What that tells me is that in the larger scope of things, it’s not the priority in my life, even if it is meaningful to me personally. It means that perhaps it is meaningful, when I have extra time and bandwidth. Soon, as I shift my career focus away from tech and into personal finance, I am curious how it will compare then. I thought about several people I could reach out to and still didn’t as I woke up every day at 5:30am and went to bed exhausted between 11pm and 1am. I’m still not quite out of the woods just yet, but we shall see. More on this later as I follow up on this.

    • #19894
      Evelyn Wallace
      Participant

      Exercise 10: Ten People of High Value

      I considered this week who the 10 people in the field were, but all I could come up with is the one person at Powder River Correctional Facility who has the authority to say yes or no to my proposal. Even so, I didn’t make the call, because I wasn’t sure if I should hit them up right out of the gate and I remember Josh saying we sort of had 3 weeks to do this assignment but not really. My question is: do I need to find another 9 people to call first, even if they feel forced/ less directly involved than the one person I know I need to call? Is the answer right in front of me if I just crack open my Initiative book?

      For what it’s worth, here’s my first draft at the script I’ll likely use to pitch the project to the VIPs:

      Survival School is a new kind of support group that provides mentorship, life skills training, and alternative pathways forward for the incarcerated population. Survival School incorporates principles of triple bottom line sustainability and uses the Spodek Method—-an exciting new methodology with a proven track record-—as fundamental to the curriculum. Meetings ideally occur weekly but the frequency can easily be adjusted. Structurally, Survival School works on a rolling entry system, where participants can drop in and drop out as they see fit and as is allowed by the facility. Survival School:
      • Helps the Department of Corrections fulfill its promise of rehabilitation
      •. Helps correctional facilities maintain order by keeping the incarcerated engaged
      • Helps outside communities by maximizing the potential successful reentry potential of returning citizens and minimizing criminality
      • Helps the incarcerated population feel ready for life on the outside and connected to resources beyond the carceral system
      • Helps the environment by utilizing intrinsic motivation

      A pilot program is currently being designed for Powder River Correctional Facility. Before I ask for actionable advice, do you have any clarifying questions so far?

      • #19895
        Evelyn Wallace
        Participant

        I can confirm Olivia’s sleep schedule. She packs it IN, day to day, friends! Also glad to see how the project born of this round of Initiative for you, Olivia, has, by the end, shown itself to fall somewhere that’s not the most important thing in your world. Good (for you!) to know!

        • #19930
          Evelyn Wallace
          Participant

          Exercise 10: People of High Value

          At first, I had an existential meltdown about my whole project, my whole idea, and even the problem I was trying to solve. (See: previous entry.) Then, after the supportive feedback from this Initiative group, I put on my big girl pants and got to work. And then immediately understood why Josh encouraged us to not think about these extra weeks that we have as “extra” at all. Because once I got to work, I learned a few things:
          • It’s true, not everyone you reach out to is going to give you the time of day. That’s just going to happen and that’s just part of it. Does it feel fabulous to be told you’re not important enough to respond to? No it does not. Does that matter much? Also no.
          • It’s also true that some people who you never thought would answer your call… answer your call
          • “People of high value” seemed to me very limiting at first, but expands with just a little effort. If I was implementing a program at Powder River Correctional Facility, isn’t there only one valuable person: the person who has the power to say yeah or nay to the project? But what about other prison reform/ prisoner support advocates? What about people who have also run support groups? What about people who run any kind of group “on the inside”? What about the people who run sustainability leadership workshops? Aren’t these people valuable, too?
          • The day Josh and I see eye to eye on “doing the reps,” the heavens will part and the angels will sing. I didn’t get to 10 people but I worked really hard, okay???

          Here’s the collective advice I gathered:
          • Start with the chaplain of the prison (they are usually in charge of programming)
          • Keep curriculum accessible to newcomers, but add enough novelty that it’s not boring for folks who do come every week
          • Incorporate leadership skills; in AA, folks come, learn, give back. Embed leadership into the programming.
          • Be open to learning from them. The chefs in the kitchens are the inmates, and often take those roles very seriously.
          • Consider getting new recruits for the program from prison orientation sessions (new members of the incarcerated community); at intake they often have “programs available” list, so try to get on that list (otherwise how will people know about you?)
          • Prepare materials: blurb about myself, why I’m qualified to lead this program
          • Connect with folks who have been released and find out post-release barriers: how long did it take them to get food stamps? Would they have an electrical outlet for a pressure cooker? Consider a pressure-cooker drive for recently released folks.
          • Be aware that I’m going into a place that already has a culture, a system. Draw a connection between communal group living ON A BUDGET, which they are good at. There’s a million things you can make from the 16 items from commissary.
          • Make sure to get buy-in from participants: ask them a lot of questions and continually improve program. (Then can use “this curriculum was designed in part by prisoners” forever)
          • Ensure that this is interesting to them; let them say it in their own words. DON’T just come in with “I know something YOU want”
          • Enter with HUMANITY and sense of curiosity; remember humanity of officers, too!
          • Don’t come in thinking I have all the answers; this is a learning journey and we are all on it
          • Do as much reading and research as possible on facility
          • Develop curriculum/ use as much material from system-impacted people because it resonates better

          Suggested connections:
          • Jes Wise (Oxford House)
          • “Esther” from Initiative
          • Robert Fullilove: “Prison and Parole: when the solution is part of the problem”

          • #19931
            Evelyn Wallace
            Participant

            More contact suggestions:
            –Tim Bryant, One-Love Meditation Project, Inc
            –Human Kindness Foundation

          • #19940
            Hayden Kessinger
            Participant

            Evelyn,

            Thanks a bunch for sharing. I appreciate many aspects of your post, including:

            — Recognizing how unimportant the non-responses are
            — The theme of remaining open to what you can learn from inmates
            — Incorporating leadership skills
            — Don’t act like you have the answers

            Wishing you the best on this project and very excited to see what comes of your hard work 🙂

    • #19954
      Beth
      Participant

      Exerercise 10: People of High Value

      I did not speak to 10 valuable people. I did talk to people, I visited communities where I thought I was going to talk to people but in which that didn’t work out as I had envisioned. Nonetheless, I had a number of contacts that were helpful and that moved me forward on my project.

      I had been referred by a priest here to a mission church in a pueblo outside of Merida. I think it was his thought that I could do something to “help” them as they are a community of very poor people. I spoke with the madre who is the spiritual leader of the mission and she was open and inviting for my visit. However, there was no opportunity for me to talk to the people of the community during my visit and on the way back to Merida she shared with me that she had spoken with some of the leadership people in the congregation and that what she presented to them wasn’t of interest to them. I don’t know what she said, but I didn’t have the chance to speak with them myself.

      I then visited the “home” church that is in my neighborhood the following Sunday. I was hoping to speak with people in that congregation after the service but the service was a special celebration that joined the Spanish speaking and English speaking congregations and was therefore very long and I was unable to stay for further discussion. I plan to go back to try again to speak with people who may be interested in joining me.

      1. I met the incoming Secretary of Citizen Participation (a position with the incoming City Council) in a small group setting. I had the opportunity to present my idea and he was enthusiastic about my project and had the following to contribute:
      1) Get Mexican people involved.
      2) Follow up with his office for possible support in school projects that include children’s art and participation.
      3) Inform him of events, send photos etc.

      2. I spoke individually with the woman in this office who is responsible for migrant relations. Her background is cultural anthropology and she had the following suggestions:
      1) Clarify what your goal is. Is the goal “just” picking up trash? Is there a longer term idea or underlying value? This helped (again) clarify my intention to build community and raise awareness of not creating trash in the first place.
      2) Get concrete with what you’re doing so others can join you now.
      3) She suggested that I collect along a path of the cities “Puntos Verdes” (recycling centers) and I could then immediately have a place to dispose of the collected waste without taking it home.
      4) There is a “cultural center” at the local coffee shop where we met that is new and that is an open space for community members to use in whatever “cultural” enterprise they would like. She introduced me to several people and suggested it might be a space I could use for meetings and introducing the project to others.

      3. I returned to speak to a restaurant owner that stopped me in the street to ask about the progress and to reiterate his interest in the project.
      1) Invite people to join me on Sundays and take photos.
      2) Get a Facebook page up right away where info and photos can be posted.
      3) Follow up with a graphic artist contact (he plans to go with me to make an introduction) to get a decal/poster designed and produced.

      4. Radio reporter informed me that the interview he taped of me on the street was used in a radio program on community events, the first in a series of “La Ciudad que Queremos” (The City we Want”).
      1) Provided a contact of a woman who is also involved in radio and other media suggesting she would do an interview in English about the involvement of expats participating in beautifying the city.
      2) Offered further assistance with contacts when I want.

      I have felt like I need to make some decisions about the project before proceeding with more conversations. I am at this point continuing with the idea of inviting others to join me on Sundays and to develop a decal or small poster that I can give to businesses and individuals who commit to maintaining their properties free from trash. I also will start a Facebook page that allows them to share their journey of “loving Merida” in photos and stories. I will do this as a step toward the solution I have already stated, as stated below.

      New Problem: Same as old problem
      New Solution: Hold a clean-up event in either one or both a church community and a school community based on city pride and stewardship. Establish a leadership group from the communities involved to develop the details of the event and to take ownership of it.

      REFLECTIONS:
      I have not found it easy to stay within the structure of the recommended exercise. As I take some further concrete steps, I think I will have further questions and will be better able to make contact with “valuable people” actually fruitful. I continue to feel encouraged by the response of people with whom I speak. I also find myself discouraged when I walk down the streets and am confronted with how big the problem is. At these times I go back to Zoi’s question about is the real goal trash (it is at least partially true) or something else. I want this to be a way to build community and consciousness. Community connects us in ways that increases our desire to take care of one another and consciousness also opens us to our part in caring for the environment around us. I continue to focus on the “task” of trash while keeping these foundational ideas in the front of my mind.

      • #19955
        Hayden Kessinger
        Participant

        Beth,

        Thank you for sharing your conversations and reflections. I got in touch with my old college club, The Sustainable Ocean Alliance at UMD, to invite them to join the next Sustainability Leadership workshop, and was reminded of all the Sundays I spent cleaning up campus with them. I felt the same way (I think) that you’re feeling. Encouraged by the community aspect but immensely discouraged to return to the same spots and clean up the same amount of trash every week. I always gave a little “speech” at the end of our cleanups to remind participants that the problem really wasn’t the trash on our campus, but the fact that we were creating waste in the first place. I think it got through to a few people which is nice. I really did love the community feeling of picking up litter and chatting with new and old friends. I think it’s a great medium to inspire change and I’m looking forward to seeing how you make that crucial link 🙂

    • #19962
      Jim Jenkins
      Participant

      LIVING THE ‘ASK FOR ADVICE’ MANTRA

      I’ve been time challenged to compete exercise 10 within the accepted timeline due to other commitments that were set months ago. BUT, I am not wavering in my commitment to do so, rather thinking through it carefully and adapting it into a near term real-life change project I have on the go. In my experience, the sooner I can integrate the INITIATIVE principles into the very fabric of what how and I’m doing, then the faster I change and increase my success.

      So here is the story. Nine months ago I committed to giving a presentation at a Product Stewardship Society conference which ran last week. The topic I spoke about had to do with a live case study on leveraging the existing product stewardship function in an organization to enable greater sustainability practices. It is based on my efforts in the company I work for and which included the practice of the INITIATIVE exercises and my topic of employee sustainability engagement. The talk was meant to be an inspiration for product stewardship people in other companies to get more involved in sustainability and how to go about it.

      Over the course of the past 3 months, I’ve been defining the business approach for the above and integrating the INITIATIVE principles into this talk. At the beginning of the talk I very clearly indicated my ask of the audience was to ask questions, identify gaps in my approach and give me advice on making it better. I had a full room of 45 people and at the end, the questions and helpful comments were overwhelming. The organizer had to kick us out of the room to run the next event.

      The following are examples of the comments,
      You are the only speaker (out of 42 or so) who asked for our input and advice.
      We want you to come back next year and give us an update.
      Can we start a help/working network to progress these ideas further?
      What is your moonshot goal that you hope to achieve?
      What advice do you have for smaller teams who get pulled in many difference sustainability directions?
      An offer to put me in contact with the right person in DuPont (who I mentioned) about my idea to partner on a specific sustainability matter.

      Companies in the room: Lockheed Martin, DuPont, Exxon, Johnson Controls, Shell, Michaelman’s, …..

      • #19963
        Hayden Kessinger
        Participant

        Jim,

        This is awesome to read. Congratulations and well done on providing such a valuable talk to those important people! I think the first comment you include speaks volumes.

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